TWG LXXIV: Poker Face Post-Game

[mikey]

Since it's almost over I'm getting a head start.

Don't read till game's over

Seriously, I mean it.  Don't.

Haha sucker I copy pasted it somewhere else until the game ends

Spoiler

PAN PAKA PAN
Humans win!

Role reveal!

Master Wolf Casino Owner-Latios212 Wolf MVP
Wolf Shuffler-AwesomeYears

Seer-Bubbles
Guardian-Fank009

Human-Maelstrom  Human MVP
Human-BlackDragonSlayer
Human-Jub3r7

Miller- MarioLegoFan

Overall impressive game by the humans.  You hit a red every single day phase, so nearly flawless there.  I'm not impressed with the inactivity.  Part of it was perhaps due to the low number of players, and nighttime voting is certainly a mechanic I'd like to test out in the future with more players.
My thoughts:
- It was possible for the wolves to target AwesomeYears night one and "confirm him human", but this is a strategy that's really out there and I wasn't really expecting to see.

- 2 new players as the wolves!  Good first game guys, really good!

- At first glance it seems like fank should get human MVP, BUT Maelstrom was confirmed human for the first time in his TWG history, and actually won a bet night 1.  Fank made some questionable guarding decisions in my opinion, but still did great nonetheless!  Especially with that bluff at the end!

- Wolves were very close to winning!  If anything you should have gone for fank again night 2, because you guys were worried he would be guarded night 1 (he was.)

- You guys should have known who the seer was!  In a game with a guardian it's pretty beneficial for the seer to claim right off!  Only 1 person hadn't posted and that happened to be Bubbles, the missing seer


Log
Night 1:
Latios212 gives AwesomeYears a vote counter
Fank009 guards himself.
Maelstrom puts 1 charge on BDS.
BDS is wolfed.
Maelstrom gets 2 vote charges
BDS dies.

Day 1:
Fank uses 1 vote charge.
MarioLegoFan is lynched.
MarioLegoFan dies.

Night 2:
Bubbles seers Latios212 red.
Fank009 guards Bubbles.
Fank009 puts 1 charge on Maelstrom
Maelstrom is wolfed.
Fank009 gets 2 vote charges
Maelstrom dies.

Day 2:
fank009 places two vote charges on Latios123.
Latios123 places two vote charges on Jub3r7.
Bubbles places a vote charge on Latios123.
Latios123 dies.

Night 3:
Bubbles seers AwesomeYears Red.
fank009 guards Bubbles.
Jub3r7 dies.

Day 3:
Bubbles places two vote charges on AwesomeYears.
fank009 places a vote charge on AwesomeYears.
AwesomeYears loses 5 vote charges due to being lynched.

Night 4:
fank009 guards Bubbles.
Bubbles is attacked but survives.

Day 4:
AwesomeYears forfeits.

[close]

[close]

[close]

[Latios212]

DAMMIT AWESOMEYEARS WE AGREED ON WOLFING FANK LAST NIGHT

This game was in the bag once I sent you that PM with the game-ending strategy. Why did you change your mind and go for Bubbles last minute >.>

[Mashi]

It was impossible for AwesomeYears to win anyway.  He had one vote charge left, whereas fank009 and Bubbles would both have at least 2 on the last Day Phase.  So even if he did manage to wolf one of fank009 or Bubbles, he would have lost due to the lynch during the last Day Phase.

[Latios212]

Wait, I thought wolves win when # wolves = # humans?

[Maelstrom]

I am seriously impressed that people finaly belived I was not a wolf.
I seriously have just been a basic human every game. EVERY GAME.
(Except for when I was the invisible charismatic human)

[BlackDragonSlayer]

Bubbles was dead-on as a seer. o_o

[Bubbles]

I'll take the praise of being a good seer even though I forgot to seer night one lmao

still kinda disappointed the story was never finished though

[AwesomeYears]

I'm sorry Latios  _{plz don't hurt moi}

On another note, being a Wolf Shuffler makes it hard to discuss and not vote so...

[Latios212]

Don't worry about it,  it was fun [emoji14]

Wait, I thought wolves win when # wolves = # humans?

Can someone address my question though?

[Bubbles]

Can someone address my question though?

In the case where the number of Wolves is greater than or equal to that of the Humans, but the Humans can still manage to lynch the Wolves due to vote manipulation that won't result in a series of KitB's, the game will continue.  Or more simply put, the game does not necessarily end.

So to answer your question, no, the Wolves wouldn't win in your hypothetical scenario.

[Latios212]

Dang, I never read that in the rules

[fank009]

Since it's almost over I'm getting a head start.

Don't read till game's over

Seriously, I mean it.  Don't.

Haha sucker I copy pasted it somewhere else until the game ends

Spoiler

PAN PAKA PAN
Humans win!

Role reveal!

Master Wolf Casino Owner-Latios212 Wolf MVP
Wolf Shuffler-AwesomeYears

Seer-Bubbles
Guardian-Fank009

Human-Maelstrom  Human MVP
Human-BlackDragonSlayer
Human-Jub3r7

Miller- MarioLegoFan

Overall impressive game by the humans.  You hit a red every single day phase, so nearly flawless there.  I'm not impressed with the inactivity.  Part of it was perhaps due to the low number of players, and nighttime voting is certainly a mechanic I'd like to test out in the future with more players.
My thoughts:
- It was possible for the wolves to target AwesomeYears night one and "confirm him human", but this is a strategy that's really out there and I wasn't really expecting to see.

- 2 new players as the wolves!  Good first game guys, really good!

- At first glance it seems like fank should get human MVP, BUT Maelstrom was confirmed human for the first time in his TWG history, and actually won a bet night 1.  Fank made some questionable guarding decisions in my opinion, but still did great nonetheless!  Especially with that bluff at the end!

- Wolves were very close to winning!  If anything you should have gone for fank again night 2, because you guys were worried he would be guarded night 1 (he was.)

- You guys should have known who the seer was!  In a game with a guardian it's pretty beneficial for the seer to claim right off!  Only 1 person hadn't posted and that happened to be Bubbles, the missing seer


Log
Night 1:
Latios212 gives AwesomeYears a vote counter
Fank009 guards himself.
Maelstrom puts 1 charge on BDS.
BDS is wolfed.
Maelstrom gets 2 vote charges
BDS dies.

Day 1:
Fank uses 1 vote charge.
MarioLegoFan is lynched.
MarioLegoFan dies.

Night 2:
Bubbles seers Latios212 red.
Fank009 guards Bubbles.
Fank009 puts 1 charge on Maelstrom
Maelstrom is wolfed.
Fank009 gets 2 vote charges
Maelstrom dies.

Day 2:
fank009 places two vote charges on Latios123.
Latios123 places two vote charges on Jub3r7.
Bubbles places a vote charge on Latios123.
Latios123 dies.

Night 3:
Bubbles seers AwesomeYears Red.
fank009 guards Bubbles.
Jub3r7 dies.

Day 3:
Bubbles places two vote charges on AwesomeYears.
fank009 places a vote charge on AwesomeYears.
AwesomeYears loses 5 vote charges due to being lynched.

Night 4:
fank009 guards Bubbles.
Bubbles is attacked but survives.

Day 4:
AwesomeYears forfeits.

[close]

[close]

[close]

Noct, you have a lot of hindsight bias in your evalulations :/
Maelstrom was only clear because of the mechanics, no other reason. any other situation he wouldnt have been cleared... he had a good guess in BDS, and that was able to pave the way.
My guards were... whats the word, meta. I always have this huge fear of being shot Night 1, and seeing how I offered good advice, I thought I was going to, you still didnt answer my Q... so I actually didnt know who I guarded... N2-3 was meta... you don't gambit, even if you are confident in who they are going to lynch. you don't gambit, if they sack the seer, what use is that gambit, and you lost the game for humans.
Wolving me night 2 wasn't an option, you would have mael with 5-6 votes in the last 2 phases, and having double votes, me on the other hand I would have 2-3 and would have to use my votes sparingly.

In terms of MVP, I think you underestimate how I basically pulled the strings on each of the wolfings, (-night one) it was a manipulative feat to get there at the death of it, and definetly deserving of some recognition... but MVP wise, it was a team effort, everyone did their job, Vanilla humans were wolfed, I kept on bubbles/stayed alive and bubbles did good seerings... although I think we got lucky with seerings of latios vs AY

They played a good game (wonder how much I gave them, but they lost it at the death cause a) I was guardian and b) no one gambled, (no one could gamble with potentially no mislynches) they should have at least tried for a mislynch at 5... instead of trying to stall us till "parity"... it was going to get very awkward around that time, glad we didnt have that situation, but still. It was a good strategy, but it relied on people being more proactive with voting, which wasn't happening (maybe with more people?)

inactivity plagued, but I guess that was somewhat wolves doing (jokes) it was a good idea that just didnt catch any momentum

[Mashi]

Dang, I never read that in the rules

The idea behind Wolves winning when they're equal in number to the Humans is that, in most cases, the only way Humans can win is through a 50-50 shot at a KitB if they can even manage that.  And at that point (though, there is some controversy), most people agree that Wolves deserve their victory at that point.

In games with extra vote or vote manipulation powers or similar, the rule will often no longer stand, however, because the Humans winning through a 50-50 shot is no longer applicable.

[Latios212]

The idea behind Wolves winning when they're equal in number to the Humans is that, in most cases, the only way Humans can win is through a 50-50 shot at a KitB if they can even manage that.  And at that point (though, there is some controversy), most people agree that Wolves deserve their victory at that point.

In games with extra vote or vote manipulation powers or similar, the rule will often no longer stand, however, because the Humans winning through a 50-50 shot is no longer applicable.

Makes sense, although would it be possible to include that in the official rules post, or at least the game description next time? Had no idea the whole game.

It was fun though. Looking forward to playing again :3

[mikey]

As soon as AwesomeYears tried to vote he would have died due to the ruling on the Wolf Shuffler

@Bubbles and co.  Sorry story wasn't finished for obvious reasons.  Each time I host I promise I will ATTEMPT to post a full story so long as no external factors prevent it (eg I won't just say "no story cause I'm lazy")