TWG LXXII: Agents of Shield (Season 1)

[Yugi]

osnap

[Yugi]

also, lol at toby having a hissyfit at us for our decisions despite the fact that our decisions have been unanimously better than his so far

[Yugi]

*consistantly

Anyway, time for some serious talk from me now.

I'm not entirely sure which seer is the real seer, but Blueflower's play (him allowing himself to be lynched, without kicking and screaming) is similar to how he's played in Zombies (where he was human), and other human games. When he was a wolf (bowsers big blast), he tended to get angry and emotional when he was accused, which I don't think happened here. That, and the fact that Firrarrow did all the suspicious stuff I mentioned plus the fact that he produced a red seering on Blueflower when he was suspicious of him, makes me lean towards the fact that Blueflower is the real seer.

[fank009]

*consistantly

Anyway, time for some serious talk from me now.

I'm not entirely sure which seer is the real seer, but Blueflower's play (him allowing himself to be lynched, without kicking and screaming) is similar to how he's played in Zombies (where he was human), and other human games. When he was a wolf (bowsers big blast), he tended to get angry and emotional when he was accused, which I don't think happened here. That, and the fact that Firrarrow did all the suspicious stuff I mentioned plus the fact that he produced a red seering on Blueflower when he was suspicious of him, makes me lean towards the fact that Blueflower is the real seer.

Blue AND FA have red seer'd each other.

[Toby]

Toby, you are seriously misjudging the NocturneOfShadow lynch.

First of all, you've failed as an alliance leader given your activity.  Don't castigate others for making independent decisions as compensation for your lack of leadership.  Simply saying "Do such and such," isn't being a leader, it's being authoritarian.

Second, I think you're certainly falling victim to hindsight bias.  You act as if it were a clear cut case that NocturneOfShadow was the Traitor.  It wasn't.

Third, you act as if lynching the Traitor was actually a bad thing.  Chances are that, given his behaviour, the Wolves would not have wolfed him and potentially even seered him.  And considering he isn't likely to die during a Night Phase, he's basically a Day Wolf, so getting rid of him may as well be equivalent to lynching a Wolf.  I doubt it was NocturneOfShadow's intention, but lynching the Traitor is still a great lynch.

Fourth, there was not a 50% chance of killing a Wolf.  And even then, but your logic, there would be a 50% chance of killing the Seer.  It's a high risk-high reward lynch and people opted for a low risk-medium reward one, how can you blame them?

Fifth, again, your logic of it being a 50% chance of killing a Wolf.  Many people (myself included) believed that blueflower999 was potentially the Traitor.  So they opted to lynch whom they believed was a Wolf.  Why is that such a terrible thing?

Sixth, are you legitimately mad that we lynched a Wolf Day 1?  Really?  When a number of Humans believed that FireArrow is potentially our real Seer?


FireArrow, I think a seering on me would be wasteful at this point.  Chances are that blueflower999 was sincere and I'm the Miller, so I think it would be more suitable for you to seer someone like BlackDragonSlayer.

I didn't post in the thread for half a day phase, but I send many Pms to the alliance helping them and helping us try ey more reactions from people, to be honest, even if I had all the time in the world, I still wouldn't have posted in the thread before I did, I had said as soon as the night was finished to the alliance that I was going to keep down low for a bit of the phase just to say how firearrow behaves with his 'seer' result without any intervention from anyone else, and I myself would have intervened the most with anything I said, I highly doubt that not posting in a thread and instead observing your reactions for a while is inactivity that failed you all.

Most of the opinions I heard of with nocturne was that he was either traitor, seer or mason, I think you might have been the only that actually thought he was wolf and firearrow in particular had expressed his opinions on how he thought nocturne was a power role in the chat a few days ago. A traitor lynch lowers our player count, I don't think that gives us much benefit at all, the traitor doesn't need to die for us to win the game.

If we lynch a wolf the seer will die anyway, if we lynch the seer then at least we tried and we can lynch the wolf the next day, consistently leaving the two seer claims alive gives us less and less humans to work with afterwards, and it's not got to the point where my other seer has had to reveal himself in order to try convince you who the real seer actually is.

I highly doubt the traitor would claim seer, given the fact that the wolves have a seer, it's most likely a wolf that would claim and the traitor would leave it to them.

I was mad at the reasoning for it and how firearrow managed to just lift all the accusation from him and put it on olimar instead, even though he was the most suspicious at that point and none of the reasoning really made sense. I will admit, yes it's good we lynched a wolf, but just not the way you guys handled it, it seemed like a name was suggested and everyone just joined the bandwagon.

also, lol at toby having a hissyfit at us for our decisions despite the fact that our decisions have been unanimously better than his so far

Your decisions to go against me are better than my lynch choices that never even followed through?

Because of my decisions we have an alliance, we have a confirmed human, and if you guys went with my decisions we'd have a wolf dead for sure, possibly another or at least know another, and most likely have our seer still hidden.

[Maelstrom]

Toby, I just haven't liked your judgment from the start. I'm not entirely sure why, but, like mashi said, you seem to be stating unproven things as fact.

Hey, at least NoC will shut up now.........

[FireArrow]

I didn't post in the thread for half a day phase, but I send many Pms to the alliance helping them and helping us try ey more reactions from people, to be honest, even if I had all the time in the world, I still wouldn't have posted in the thread before I did, I had said as soon as the night was finished to the alliance that I was going to keep down low for a bit of the phase just to say how firearrow behaves with his 'seer' result without any intervention from anyone else, and I myself would have intervened the most with anything I said, I highly doubt that not posting in a thread and instead observing your reactions for a while is inactivity that failed you all.

You have you remember, "alliance leader" is a misleading title. Really, you lead the thread, and you failed to do so. You come here and so, "I know this, do this." When I provide a counter argument, you just go, "no, he's wrong, do this anyways cause I said." Mashi and I proceed to have a debate over it and he comes to the conclusion that I'm human - people proceed to read over it and agree with it. You, without ever showing comprehension of what happened come back to say "no, I have information you guys don't so I'm right."

The people in the thread aren't you're loyal subjects who will obey your every whim; if you want them to believe you over me and Mashi, then you'll have to supply just as much evidence and reasoning as us, if not more. You can PM your alliance all you want, but keeping the thread out of the loop as much as you did makes you look like an Authoritarian douche stating his opinion as fact.

tl;dr Most of us here are American, and American's have an irrational (or rational depending on bias) hate for being told what to do - you have to convince us.

Most of the opinions I heard of with nocturne was that he was either traitor, seer or mason, I think you might have been the only that actually thought he was wolf and firearrow in particular had expressed his opinions on how he thought nocturne was a power role in the chat a few days ago. A traitor lynch lowers our player count, I don't think that gives us much benefit at all, the traitor doesn't need to die for us to win the game.

This is why no one listens to you, because the first part simply isn't true. You can't say "I know what's best" then proceed to show a lack of understanding of the situation.

If we lynch a wolf the seer will die anyway, if we lynch the seer then at least we tried and we can lynch the wolf the next day, consistently leaving the two seer claims alive gives us less and less humans to work with afterwards, and it's not got to the point where my other seer has had to reveal himself in order to try convince you who the real seer actually is.

I highly doubt the traitor would claim seer, given the fact that the wolves have a seer, it's most likely a wolf that would claim and the traitor would leave it to them.

I was mad at the reasoning for it and how firearrow managed to just lift all the accusation from him and put it on olimar instead, even though he was the most suspicious at that point and none of the reasoning really made sense. I will admit, yes it's good we lynched a wolf, but just not the way you guys handled it, it seemed like a name was suggested and everyone just joined the bandwagon.

All of the reasons for these decisions are clearly outlined in the thread.

Also, what's with the MIA revive? Did a human claim to have it or not? (You don't need to specify who has it, obviously.)

[FireArrow]

*consistantly

Anyway, time for some serious talk from me now.

I'm not entirely sure which seer is the real seer, but Blueflower's play (him allowing himself to be lynched, without kicking and screaming) is similar to how he's played in Zombies (where he was human), and other human games. When he was a wolf (bowsers big blast), he tended to get angry and emotional when he was accused, which I don't think happened here. That, and the fact that Firrarrow did all the suspicious stuff I mentioned plus the fact that he produced a red seering on Blueflower when he was suspicious of him, makes me lean towards the fact that Blueflower is the real seer.

I can't refute that my position compared to blueflower's is a lot more wonky, but wonky =/= suspicious. Just because someone does something unconventional (claiming a day late) means absolutely nothing if the action itself is neutral (equally bad decision for both a wolf and human.) IF you want my refute to all the "suspicious stuff" I did, it's in my giant day 1 post.

The bolded part is kinda silly. Blueflower was not lynchable, so if I was a wolf, I'd probably fabricate a red seering on someone who actually was (You, BDS, Jon, (NoS but that would of confirmed he was a traitor.))

[Toby]

Also I fidnt get a revive claim last time, if someone has the revolve now then please claim to me.

[FireArrow]

^Please.

[Yugi]

i can't wait for an inactive to get it again

Also, Mariolegofan probably got the revive, it'd explain why he neither claimed nor had the revive work.

[fank009]

"no, I have information you guys don't so I'm right."

Isn't this basically what happens in an alliance??? you complain that he has this biased point of view, but you ask that he tells all and risk the alliance in the process?
yes he knows all and we may not know everything he does, but he does have the most important task of protecting the alliance.

[Mashi]

Woah, guys!!!

I completely overlooked this, but... I'm actually the Seer!  I forgot and thought I was a normal Human all this time, I'm so sorry guys!  I don't know how I made the mix up.

Guess that means we have to lynch blueflower999 and FireArrow now!

[Jon]

FireArrow. I believe Mashi's claim.

[Mashi]

lol wait guys it turns out i must be blind!!!

I'm actually the Brutal Human (you know I know for sure this time because I have the colour right and everything).  I can't believe I let Toby's false claim last so long!  Watch out, Toby, I'm coming to you with a vengeance!!!

We should probably lynch FireArrow and blueflower999 just in case though.  They're probably both Wolves anyway.

In the meantime though, we mus get rid of the biggest false claimer of them all; Toby!!!  Your reign of terror must be put to a stop.  Because you are not simply a Brutal Human... but a Brutal Wolf!!!!!!!!!

Toby