Pokémon Omega Ruby & Alpha Sapphire

[FireArrow]

^Yeah, I meant that it does damage. Depending on what gets hit, you can dent it. Or do chip damage if you prefer.
As I said, I'm not saying it's bad. I think attacking twice is better than lowering a stat and have them switch out (not counting if they're stuck in because of shadow tag/mean look/whatever). I don't think metal sound would ever be better than a coverage move that does damage. I'd use it on a gimmicky team for fun. If he wants to use that move, he can go for it. I'm just stating why I don't think it's that great of an option.

Bar breaking sashes/sturdy, the chip damage means nothing. Acid spray is used solely for the stat drops....

Never mind, I take everything back I said, you're right. For some reason I was under the impression that attacking something at -2 does more damage than attacking twice, whereas it actually does less after I ran some calcs. >_>

The only case I would say it's viable would be to ease prediction on a coverage based pokemon, but that's stretching it.

[Roz~]

^Chip damage can be good if you're trying to put something in range of one of your sweeper. Say, for example, you have an SD Scizor in the back, you have stealth rocks up, and your end game plan is to set up with said Scizor. Not only do you get stat drops, but you also get some damage out of that move, which can put things in range of your attacks. I know it's mostly use for the stat drops, but getting some damage out of it is an added bonus. And yeah, sometimes calcs are tricky like that =P

Anyway I'm done trying to explain this to the other guy, I've been trying to explain why I believe it can be fun to use it may not be the best option ever, but clearly he didn't like me pointing it out.

[FireArrow]

NoS is like NSM's local scrub. Except league, he seems to give good advice for that. :3

[K-NiGhT]

yeah nocturne i have to agree that you should probably study more about the stuff you claim to know before you start spouting wrong stuff from your mouth

[mikey]

Guys, I kinda meant that they're pros so they know a lot!  Not that they're being egotistical...
I realize that you guys spend way more time on this sort of stuff than me and you know better than I do!  I don't claim to know anything!!!  Sheesh.

NoS is like NSM's local scrub. Except league, he seems to give good advice for that. :3

I know a lot about league mechanics and stuff but I can't play it lol
too hard
The one game I'm good at is MTG, specifically limited events
QQ and by good I mean not bad.  As far as I know I'm just average, but I can regularly beat most people at my store, and the people online are legit scrubs

[FireArrow]

I know a lot about league mechanics and stuff but I can't play it lol
too hard

wut
no
mobas = relatively low skill game with a bunch of people thinking they're super good

It's a team based strategy game. It's based upon how well you can work together with your (preferably) premade team of friends.

[FierceDeity]

I think that's a bit overly simplistic. I may not particularly enjoy league, but there's considerably more to it than just "cmon guys let's work together". Idk what you mean by "low skill"; do you mean that the people who play it are unskilled, or that there's a low skill cap? Because really, watch some high level players; even I can appreciate the level of skill and precise timing it takes to be a top player. Considering it's all based on the skill of your opponent, any meaning you intended by calling all MOBAs "low-skill" is pretty uncalled for, especially if it's just to shit all over nocturne some more.

[mikey]

I have absolutely horrendous reflexes
and decision making
but i have top tier teamwork and good mechanics, plus decent understanding of map control.
hence bad

shit all over nocturne some more.

let's all do that some more ^_^

[FireArrow]

I think that's a bit overly simplistic. I may not particularly enjoy league, but there's considerably more to it than just "cmon guys let's work together". Idk what you mean by "low skill"; do you mean that the people who play it are unskilled, or that there's a low skill cap? Because really, watch some high level players; even I can appreciate the level of skill and precise timing it takes to be a top player. Considering it's all based on the skill of your opponent, any meaning you intended by calling all MOBAs "low-skill" is pretty uncalled for, especially if it's just to shit all over nocturne some more.

No, not to shit on nocturne. It's mostly to shit on the annoying people who go "I play Dota/League, I'm a hard core gamer unlike you casuals!"

You can have professionals at anything and they'll be really fucking good at it. So that's a moot point.

Low-skill as in it's not technical - poor choice on my part I guess. League is not a game of individual skill (look at this shiny combo I can do!!1!!!) it's literally a team based strategy game. Nocturne knows his shit about when and where you should do something, which pretty much defines league.

Imagine any moba as a 1v1 game then compare it to any other competitive game. I rest my case.

[mikey]

that gives me a good idea

[Echo]

I just personally think the aversion to stat drop moves is a bit of a band wagon without anyone really evaluating it. Similarly with defense boosting moves. Just because something sucks most of the time doesn't mean it doesn't have a niche on some sets.

I'm replying to you for bringing this up, but this is more for Nocturne's sake since he seems to be new to Pokemon fundamentals.

Stat drop moves are alright, but what you have to think about when using them is whether or not you can actually generate turn advantage by using them. When you lower something like Speed (like with Sticky Web/Icy Wind) or Attack/Sp Attack (like with Intimidate/Snarl), you potentially get more turns in the long run by outpacing your opponent's damage output. So if you want to force switches that way, use these kinds of things since they actually help you whether the opponent stays in or not.

By using Defense/Special Defense drops though, you'll probably lose out in the end if all the move does is debuff (like with Metal Sound or Screech). Like, the turn you would use Metal Sound, the opponent's move that turn goes unhindered and still hits you for full damage. On the next turn, you do the same damage as if you attacked twice, or they go unpunished if they just switch. The only time those moves would really be useful is if you're trying to outpace walls that heal with Recover or buff with Calm Mind or something.

Defense/Special Defense buffs have other issues if they don't boost other stats too. Like if the opponent uses Roar/Whirlwind, then you'd lose all your setup just like that. At least with an Attack buff, you'd be doing more damage the turn they use that. Also, crits exist, so they make you extra sad when you get KO'd after buffing to +6. And just in general, scoring KOs > stalling, so Attack/Speed buffs are more valuable since you can get long-term advantage if they don't stop you.


That being said, I recall Zapdos being a fun Metal Sound user back in the day. Metal Sound to scare whatever comes in, then get a free Roost/Substitute/Volt Switch to get in better position. Or if you have hazards like Stealth Rock up, just Roar to troll them by giving double entry hazard damage.

[mikey]

echo ur awesome

[FireArrow]

Defense/Special Defense buffs have other issues if they don't boost other stats too. Like if the opponent uses Roar/Whirlwind, then you'd lose all your setup just like that. At least with an Attack buff, you'd be doing more damage the turn they use that. Also, crits exist, so they make you extra sad when you get KO'd after buffing to +6. And just in general, scoring KOs > stalling, so Attack/Speed buffs are more valuable since you can get long-term advantage if they don't stop you.

The reason I say this is because I ran iron defense ferrothorn once to counter setup sweeepers. He was my teams only answer to mega scizor/mega gyra but swords dance variants would just use it as set-up bait, thus I replaced the 4th slot with iron defence so I could boost along side them and not get run over.

Otherwise I'd agree. Boosting your defenses to +6 in an effort to sweep is a bad idea (I'm looking at you cosmic power clefable, please run calm mind.)

[Jub3r7]

This is a reminder, don't forget to download Reckless Emboar and Contrary Serperior using the Mystery Gift codes POKEMON500 and POKEMON497. Samurott's hidden ability isn't available yet, but I'm not sure when these two gifts end.

[Ruto]

Bulbapedia says you have until November.

I'm currently having a Pokemon breed-a-thon with my non hacked 6 31 iv spheal that I bred myself! (and a ton of other 5 31 iv pokes). I'm looking for some Pokemon. Right now I have an excess of 4 31 iv Protean Froakies and Lightning Rod 4-5 iv Electrikes and some Clamperls/Feebas/Horseas/Bagons. Working on the grass starters right now and Mareep (I breed mostly water and dragon types). If any friends want to trade, I'm looking for Cyndaquil, Hidden Ability Torchic and Mudkip. At least 2 31 iv and/or females for ease!