TWG 60: 2fool4skool

[BlackDragonSlayer]

(Im pretty sure you used this argument against me before...)
just a few things,
one- Wolves cant use "simliar" leaps in logic?
two- yes, my logic is patchy (at times), but its attitude, I feel your taking this very stubbornly, in the sense that I have little to no case (somewhat of a fact), and attitude is another basis for the case (which you seem to fail to understand)

1: In conclusion, anybody can. Thus, it's terrible reasoning to use that as evidence.
2: But isn't that somewhat normal for me (see: other games, e.g. The Choice is Doors)? Some people, though, are very similar as a human or a wolf (such as you, given that you're confusing to people, like me ).

BUT... who are the fools/(fool?) if the scumteam is TST/Mashi...

Here are the likely outcomes:
1: Wolves; Mashi, TST.
Fools; FSM, Maestro, ??

2: Wolves: FSM, ??
Fools; Mashi, TST, Maestro

[The_Subjective_Thought]

I personally think Olimar's a fool.

[Mashi]

BlackDragonSlayer and fank009 have been the only two people posting in the topic and this game is going downhill really fast!!!

I'm going to explain this one last time.

FSM-Reapr was very likely a Wolf.  There is no reason for him to have voted for me Day 1 when he could have easily lynched himself if he were Fool.  That he voted for me and we even had conversations together that substantiated that we weren't Partners is enough to point that if either of were Wolves, we weren't Partners.  In addition to that, both Wolves acting like Fools would be suicide to the Team anyway.
The only other possible option is for FSM-Reapr to have trolled the Humans as a Fool, but I'm not so sure he would do that.

There's no logic between pairing me with The_Subjective_Thought.  There's no Fool Network in which we all decide to act like Fools.  Proclaiming that we're Wolf Partners together is even more ridiculous though; as I mentioned previously, both Wolves wouldn't act like Fools, it's too risky.  Not to mention, I've had two occasions to have possibly lynched myself on Day and Day 2; do you really think I'm a Fool?
Plus, I claimed Fool to the thread in hopes of being able to out the other two Fools and Wolf to the thread for an easy victory.  Based on only receiving one Fool claim though (The_Subjective_Thought's), this implies that either:
Two Fools are dead (them being FSM-Reapr and MaestroUGC), since there being two Wolves would not make them desperate for a Fool-Wolf alliance.
One Fool and one Wolf didn't want to take the risk and so didn't claim.

The logical conclusion to come from all of this, in other words, is that I'm not a Fool and I'm not a Wolf.  I'm Human.  The only reason I've been acting as a Fool this game was because a few people legitimately believed my claim to have OP Powers and I couldn't take any of you seriously (sorry!!!)!


Anyway, I'm presuming that the Day Phase ends today at 10PM CDT.  Unfortunately, I'm going to be at a concert during that time, so I won't have time to post passed 3PM or 4PM EST.
I'll place a tentative vote on davy for now; his reasoning of being suspicious of FSM-Reapr and then suddenly voting for me doesn't make too much sense.

I'll try to make a suspicion list sometime before I leave.

[Waddle Bro]

I'm starting to lose interest thanks to Pokémon but I guess I should try to continue doing the best I can. Sozzles

I believe Mashi's telling the truth. I don't see him being partners with FSM or TST.

But I'm so lost when it comes to suspects.

voting later

[davy]

Davy: Davy's posts about Bubbles were one of the thing that convinced me to vote for her, but given the cardflip, we know that Bubbles was a human (though, that alone doesn't mean much).

The same can be said about verm. I'd like to know what makes the difference between us two.

also, the lean on olimar... is explained in this chat log (only one Im going to look up for tonight, (I left it too late and Im tired :/)
(In short... good work TST, you fooled fank.)

Fank, I know you can do better than that. How was TST's post so convincing that you fell for it?

Vote comming up in the next post.

[davy]

I said a vote was comming up, but I decided that a suspicion list would be better atm.

3. vermilionvermin: Has been acting like normal verm so far. However, he's always a dangerous player, so I'll keep an eye on him. He also hasn't fallen victim to the (NSM version of the) Manti Rule.
4. Waddle Bro: You're not posting much, so it's kind of hard to get a read on you. I'd like to see more of you.
5. The_Subjective_Thought: You're acting a lot like a fool, and you probably are one. However, I still think it's possible that you are a wolf together with Mashi which I will discribe later.
8. fank009: You're very confusing, as usual. The fact that you went after the fools day 2 makes me pretty suspicious of you atm. I'm watching you.
9. Mashi: If TST and you are wolf partners, you are doing pretty well so far, because people are afraid of lynching TST and you are convincing people that you are a human pretty well. Is it risky for both wolves to claim fool? yes. Can it have a high reward? absolutely. Additionally, your reason for not being a wolf is because a wolf team of you and FSM doesn't make sense. In other words, you completely base your defense on FSM being a wolf. First of all, I know you can do better than that, and seccondly, you stated yourself that it could be possible that FSM was a fool trying to screw the human team. It's basicly the same as the reason why you vote for me: I call FSM suspicious but vote for you (according to you because nobody reads my defense), and you said it may be possible that FSM was a fool, but base your entire defense on him being a wolf.
11. Olimar12345: Has been acting pretty human-like so far.
13. BlackDragonSlayer: I feel like your situation with FSM is similar to the situation of Thiannon with TBWCW in Game of Wolves. First you are saying that it's likely he's a wolf, but when there's no advantage anymore to follow that strain of thought, you decide he probably is a wolf. That's not that much of a problem, but you did something similar and even more suspicious later in the game:

Davy: Davy's posts about Bubbles were one of the thing that convinced me to vote for her, but given the cardflip, we know that Bubbles was a human (though, that alone doesn't mean much).

You follow the bubble's lynch and vote for her, but when there's no advantage in thinking Bubbles is a wolf, you say that I was the one who convinced you to vote her, and you call me suspicious for that. Immediately afterwards, you say it doesn't mean much, which means you are even further giving the feeling that your actions for the Bubbles lynch didn't mean much.

I'm currently most suspicious of BDS and Mashi with Fank at a distant 3rd. I'll give all of them some time to reply before I vote, however. I'll also be in the chatroom, if anyone wants to chat with me.

[Waddle Bro]

I know FSM and he ain't that type of person to be screwing anybody over unnecessarily.

[davy]

I know FSM and he ain't that type of person to be screwing anybody over unnecessarily.

Maybe he didn't realize he was screwing people over. I mean, it's not as if he got the chance to change his vote to himself. But this is just speculation.

[Olimar12345]

No quite sure who to vote for yet, so safety on mashi for now. Will post suspicions later.

[BlackDragonSlayer]

You follow the bubble's lynch and vote for her, but when there's no advantage in thinking Bubbles is a wolf, you say that I was the one who convinced you to vote her, and you call me suspicious for that. Immediately afterwards, you say it doesn't mean much, which means you are even further giving the feeling that your actions for the Bubbles lynch didn't mean much.

About the statement in bold:
1: Read this. You were, which is why I mentioned it.
2: I specifically said that the Bubbles lynch didn't necessarily make you suspicious (if it did, you would've been above fank), at least when taken alone as a single action (humans, obviously, can make mistakes with lynches, so leading such a lynch doesn't necessarily make you suspicious; but when combined with your other actions in the game, it does make you somewhat more suspicious to me). Earlier, you asked what makes you different from verm: your earlier vote for Mashi instead of FSM, which verm talks about in his post.

[vermilionvermin]

Changed the title.

Mashi told me at the time he claimed fool that he was intending to do it to draw out wolf/fool claims and mentioned the TST claim as well.  I'm inclined to believe he's human.

I don't think either fank or BDS is a wolf.  Fank being a wolf makes 0 sense to me.  I know he was present in the chat when FSM was being lynched.  He had the ability to save FSM and chose not to.  If he was a wolf I feel that he'd be able to use this to his advantage by saying that FSM was a wolf like most of the rest of the players believe. 

BDS is acting really really similarly to how he was as TWG Kirby last game.

Waddle would have been able to save FSM as well by voting for Mashi (or even just removing the vote for FSM).

Mashi being a wolf is a definite possibility.  I think he's human though, and if he's not a human it's much more likely that he's actually a fool.  Him claiming fool made TST look more like a fool so we're more likely to lynch him before TST.

I have concerns about Davy being a wolf too.  Wolfing Maestro Night 2 and then supporting lynching Bubbles really doesn't make much sense.  The logic that points to Bubbles being a wolf also points to him (and Maestro too).  It would've been way safer to wolf someone like me, Waddle Bro, or Fank.

TST seems like a likely fool to me.

This leaves me with Olimar.  Even if TST was lying about Olimar's PM to him, that by no means clears Olimar.  Additionally, the Maestro wolfing strikes me as one an inexperienced wolf would make since I feel there were much better options that had a lesser chance of being lynched who were also not obvious fools (myself, Waddle Bro, and fank).  I feel like he ignored FSM for the majority of the phase (going from a vote on Mashi to a safety on BDS and not posting late enough in the phase to be able to save FSM).

[davy]

It's a close call between Mashi and BDS for me, but I feel like BDS has done a better job defending himself.

Good night everyone.

[BlackDragonSlayer]

Similarly to davy, at this point for me, it's a tough choice between davy and Mashi (still keeping an eye on Fank, though ), although, if Davy is a wolf, he's likely the only wolf alive, but if Mashi's a wolf, it's likely that his partner is alive.

Thus, due to the increased risk of lynching davy over Mashi (and other evidence about Mashi), I must vote for Mashi.

To talk about what Verm said:
It seems like Mashi is acting really weird this game; as I mentioned before, it's very likely that he's a wolf acting like a fool (or vice versa), or just a wolf/fool trying to act as unpredictable as possible and hoping that a good outcome will come from it (e.g. as a fool, hoping you see him as a wolf and lynch him, but as a wolf, hoping you see him as a fool and keep him alive).
Verm also mentioned Mashi talking about a "TST claim," but didn't Mashi seem to be in contact with/know about TST beforehand (unless I'm mixing up my sequence of events), which is something else entirely that needs to be explained (which I tried to do, but people seemed to reject)?

[vermilionvermin]

I'm talking about the exchange here:  http://www.ninsheetm.us/smf/index.php?topic=5892.msg229476#msg229476

I don't know why there needs to be an exchange before that for it to make sense.

[fank009]

Similarly to davy, at this point for me, it's a tough choice between davy and Mashi (still keeping an eye on Fank, though ), although, if Davy is a wolf, he's likely the only wolf alive, but if Mashi's a wolf, it's likely that his partner is alive.

Thus, due to the increased risk of lynching davy over Mashi (and other evidence about Mashi), I must vote for Mashi.

To talk about what Verm said:
It seems like Mashi is acting really weird this game; as I mentioned before, it's very likely that he's a wolf acting like a fool (or vice versa), or just a wolf/fool trying to act as unpredictable as possible and hoping that a good outcome will come from it (e.g. as a fool, hoping you see him as a wolf and lynch him, but as a wolf, hoping you see him as a fool and keep him alive).
Verm also mentioned Mashi talking about a "TST claim," but didn't Mashi seem to be in contact with/know about TST beforehand (unless I'm mixing up my sequence of events), which is something else entirely that needs to be explained (which I tried to do, but people seemed to reject)?

I have a few problems,
-I dont understand davy being a high risk vote over mashi (though the vote I approve of.)
- why do you keep stealing my arguments :/
mashi
possibly mobile till end of day, will try to make the chat