Rhythm Groupings

[spitllama]

I... don't... understand these. It seems like it should be so easy- put down the notes for how it sounds in the original. Yet I seem to take a lot of flack about doing it wrong. What are the basics? How can you make a rhythm grouping more appropriate but still sound the same?

Some examples of arrangements that have received comments about this are
Phantom Ganon
Menu Theme
Sunset Colosseum

[Olimar12345]

It's all about the time signature. 4/4=4 quarter notes. Make it look like that.

[spitllama]

So if it's 4/4 time and I have a dotted quarter note, dotted quarter note, eighth note, eighth note in a measure, how can I make that look like 4 quarter notes? (made up situation)

[JDMEK5]

So if it's 4/4 time and I have a dotted quarter note, dotted quarter note, eighth note, eighth note in a measure, how can I make that look like 4 quarter notes? (made up situation)

.... You lost me.

I'm going out on a limb here and I'm going to assume that you don't want the timing changed...

The example you gave just now is perfectly legal and common. It would look like this:


(Yes, I put it in C# Major just 'cause it's my favorite key)

[spitllama]

But that's where my issue is. Why does it have to be an eighth note tied to a quarter note? Why can't I do dotted quarter note then dotted quarter note? Is it really that hard to count? I'm mean seriously -.- It's also cleaner looking.

[Olimar12345]

The rule is-You should always be able to see beat 3 in 4/4.

[JDMEK5]

The timing for a 4/4 time is: "1-and-2-and-3-and-4-and"
(Each number is worth a quarter note; the "ands" represent subdivision)
The pulse for a 4/4 time is: "Strong-and-Weak-and-Medium-and-Weak-and"

Rules:
1) A strong beat can stand for any number of medium and/or weak beats. (Within that measure)
(E.g., a whole note)

2) A medium can stand for any number of weak beats but not strong beats.
(E.g., a half note on beat 3)

3) A weak beat can't stand for anything besides itself. (Not even another weak)
(E.g., a quarter note on beats 2 and/or 4)

4) Off-beats can always be represented by the beat to the left and can't stand for anything besides themselves.

If you want a half note on beat 2, you have to tie two quarter notes. Because, if not, you'd have a weak beat standing for a medium.
The example here has the "and" after the second beat standing for beat 3. "Ands" cannot stand for anything besides themselves. (Golden rule)

And that's why you need a tie.

The rule is-You should always be able to see beat 3 in 4/4.

There is one exception to that rule, and that is if you have a whole note on beat 1.
If not, he's right because beat 3 is a medium beat. And medium beats can only be represented by a strong.

Don't ask me why this is the way it is, it just is. I didn't make it up, and it really cleans stuff up when you get into hybrid time. (E.g., 5/8, 7/8, 11/16, etc.)

Wikipedia has an article on this, but it doesn't quite cover this aspect.
Wikipedia

And that concludes today's theory lesson on pulse and timing. ... Seriously though, did you get all that?

[spitllama]

This is my ignorance talking, but what dumb rules...

Thank you JDMEK for the info. I will definitely refer back to it in the future.

[JDMEK5]

No problem! I was worried I didn't make it clear enough...

[Olimar12345]

This is my ignorance talking, but what dumb rules...

These rules make music easier and faster to read.

[JDMEK5]

They also really clear things up when one adds a drum line.

[Shadoninja]

Now, though you shouldn't make a habit of writing them, it is okay to use them to save time

[spitllama]

How should a half note, dotted quarter note, and eighth note rhythm be written? (The "retranscribe" function doesn't change it). I suppose changing the dotted quarter to a quarter tied to an eighth would show the fourth beat. Is that corrrect?

[Olimar12345]

Both ways would be correct.

[spitllama]

Oh ok. I thought a change was necessary. Thanks.