TWG XXIV: Sauce Is Pretty Coll

[vermilionvermin]

It's close between Jub and Dude for me, but I'm going to go with Jub simply because I find his reaction to being called out a little bit more wolfish than Dude's.  After I pointed out that he hadn't been around much, it only took him 10 minutes to respond.  I tend to think that Dude's inactivity was more IRL stuff than Jub's.  This is liable to change if anything else jumps out at me, but nothing has.

[Bird]

jub

[Locke (Faux)]

Gzgregory didn't respond to my accusation so my vote is staying for now.

[vermilionvermin]

I had a chat with Jub.  When I asked who he'd like to lynch, he said me, which was not something I'd expect a wolf to say.  A wolf would be looking for any and all ways to survive.  Thus, I'm going to put another safety on shadowkirby.

[Jub3r7]

Had some connection issues earlier today, but they're fixed now!
Going to throw a vote on Jub3r7 for being unusually inactive, normally he's one of the most active players.

Also spitllama, vermilion was probably joking.

You're less active than I am. -.- If that's your reasoning, vote yourself. 

Also discussed a bunch of stuff in the log with vermillion (including how I suspect him, explanation of inactivity, youngster joey called me to say that he tried to catch another rattata but failed, bird's unexplained bandwagon vote, the fact that he needs to change his avatar a little bit more than just drawing on his previous one).
It'd be nice if you or Locke posted the important parts of that log, and maybe sent the whole thing to me so I can use it for reference? I forgot to save it.

Speaking of which, what is your explanation for the bandwagoning, Bird_Away? We were trying to interrogate you about that but you were away and left shortly after we asked that. :<

[vermilionvermin]

Some of the log got cut off, here's the entire log.  I'll shorten this later in another post.  I can't find a way to spoiler the conversation, so for now this post will be massive.

22:23   Vermverm   What are your thoughts on gz?
22:23   Jub3r7_   And then we came back and I probably made another post in TWG.
22:23   Jub3r7_   Oh, gz?
22:23   Jub3r7_   He's a hippocrit. >
22:23   Jub3r7_   Ignore the misspelling but
22:23   Jub3r7_   He's saying how /I'm/ inactive.
22:24   Vermverm   What do you think about his humanity?
22:24   Jub3r7_   Hang on, let me go back and read some of these posts.
22:24   Jub3r7_   I never read the post above mine from right before I left for work.
22:26   Jub3r7_   Oh and verm, if you're the brutal human and people start lynching you it'd be nice to know if you were the brutal human.
22:26   Jub3r7_   Can it hurt us for the wolves to know the identity of the brutal human?
22:26   Vermverm   I'm pretty sure the brutal human doesn't know he's the brutal human.
22:26   Vermverm   I'll PM to Mashi but I'm pretty sure I asked him that earlier.
22:27   Jub3r7_   I think it's in the thread.
22:27   Locke   "Brutal Human and Millwright are both told that they are normal Humans.  When the Brutal Human is lynched, he/she tells me the name of a Player that voted for him/her and that Player will die the same Phase as the Brutal Human is lynched.  Another person must die by the Brutal Human."
22:27   Jub3r7_   Oh,
22:27   Jub3r7_   Yeah, I found that in the thread right when you pasted that.
22:28   Jub3r7_   Or, rather, a different explanation by him.
22:29   Jub3r7_   Wait, I'm confusing myself, did I realize this earlier then forget about it?
22:29   Jub3r7_   Unless I made a typo.
22:29   Jub3r7_   Also there's not much of a chance that you're a brutal human, although there's a slight possibility that you were painted red.
22:30   Jub3r7_   Also, I presume this discussion means that the painting is done before the seering?
22:30   Vermverm   Well, the combined odds that I'm one of the two are greater than the odds of me being a wolf!
22:30   Vermverm   That was my impression.
22:30   Jub3r7_   That's a matter of opinion.
22:30   Jub3r7_   Impression?
22:31   Vermverm   I thought that the painting happened before the seering.
22:31   Vermverm   But do you think that I was less likely than most to be painted?
22:32   Jub3r7_   If I start randomly saying accusing things later in this conversation, ignore it and send me a pm of the chatlog the next day so I can see how stupid I was.
22:32   Jub3r7_   I'm tired.
22:32   Jub3r7_   Or, don't ignore it, just keep in mind that I might have no idea what I'm talking about.
22:32   Jub3r7_   Like, IF IT'S AN IMPRESSION THEN THAT MEANS YOU WEREN'T REALLY SURE SO YOU HAVE TO BE A WOLF RIGHT?
22:33   Vermverm   lol
22:33   Vermverm   (actually, it'd be the other way around)
22:33   Jub3r7_   I know. XD
22:34   Jub3r7_   Also the version of locke except with the moustache
22:34   Jub3r7_   the flying guy
22:34   Jub3r7_   except not realyl a guy
22:34   Jub3r7_   He just bandwagoned you, and that's something you should generally avoid.
22:34   Vermverm   bird-away?
22:34   Jub3r7_   Yeah.
22:35   Jub3r7_   It implies that he's using your reasoning, but I make people only vote if they have their own reasoning.
22:35   Vermverm   I didn't make him vote for you!
22:35   Jub3r7_   I know!
22:35   Vermverm   I think he should be pressed for an explanation.
22:36   Jub3r7_   I didn't say that, just curious as to why he didn't present
22:36   Jub3r7_   The explanation.
22:36   Jub3r7_   Bird-Away ??
22:36   Vermverm   well if he doesn't have one, then he might be wolf partners with dude.
22:36   Jub3r7_   Did he say how long he was going to be gone?
22:36   Jub3r7_   And why dude?
22:37   Vermverm   Dude has the second-most votes I believe.
22:38   Jub3r7_   "Gzgregory didn't respond to my accusation so my vote is staying for now.
22:38   Jub3r7_   That's his reasoning.
22:38   Vermverm   that's locke, not bird
22:38   Jub3r7_   Because him not responding makes him less suspicious?
22:38   Jub3r7_   I know
22:38   Jub3r7_   Wait did I change people
22:38   Vermverm   lol
22:38   Jub3r7_   Oh nevermind
22:38   Jub3r7_   Avatars
22:39   Jub3r7_   -.-
22:39   Vermverm   21:58   Vermverm   That wasn't the answer I was expecting from a wolf Jubert. 22:33   Vermverm   Anyways, now that Jub and Dude have been picking up on their activity, whom should I vote? 22:35   Locke   gzgregory 22:35   Vermverm   why 22:37   Locke   for the reason I gave earlier 22:37   Locke   and also because he didn't respond to it 22:37   Vermverm   Why does not responding imply
22:39   Vermverm   22:37   Vermverm   Why does not responding imply wolfitude? 22:38   Locke   Because it's a serious accusation and it's weird that he would just try to ignore it, as if to avoid bringing it up again so people don't remember it 22:38   Vermverm   Hmm...
22:39   Locke   bird-away get a new avatar
22:39   Jub3r7_   Also, there's a slight chance, Locke, that he didn't see your accusation.
22:40   Vermverm    would be a solid avatar for bird-away
22:40   Locke   Well there's always a slight chance of anything
22:40   Jub3r7_   When people "ignore" stuff I send them pm's with quotes of my accusations and demand that they respond!
22:41   Jub3r7_   Also shadow_kirby's inactivity partially screwed me over last game, twas why I'm specifically angry at him.
22:41   Vermverm   He was pretty active in the chat today.
22:41   Vermverm   Or I at least was able to talk to him in one.
22:42   Vermverm   I sent it to mashi, let me see if I remembered to save it.
22:43   Vermverm   I'll send it to you guys, but there's one part I'm going to take out because people were being dumb.
22:43   Vermverm   wait, this is a different log.
22:43   Vermverm   fffs i only saved one of the two.
22:44      *** Jub3r7__ joined #twg
22:44   Jub3r7__   Also to finish explaining inactivity, I came back and made another TWG post or two and then left for work and came back very tired and might have forgotten about twg until 1 oclock, then I made a post in twg and went in the chat for a minute but then went off so my brother could read homestuck without the internet disconnecting every five seconds!
22:45   Jub3r7__   And then this morning I overslept and woke up at 2:33, I checked TWG and I don't remember whether or not I posted anything right awahy.
22:45   Jub3r7__   I was still tired from the sleep overdose and didn't see anything extremely important to add (although there's always something to add, twas just too tired to think about it.)
22:46   Vermverm   ok, the log was sent.
22:46      *** Jub3r7_ quit (Ping timeout)
22:46      *** Jub3r7__ is now known as Jub3r7_
22:46   Jub3r7_   And then I saw an accusation and was like "fiiine I'll post"
22:46   Jub3r7_   And then I played more HeartGold and checked email
22:46   Jub3r7_   And other stuff and then made a rushed post for TWG before leaving for work.
22:46   Vermverm   which starter did you pick
22:46   Jub3r7_   Totodile, duh!
22:46   Vermverm   
22:46   Vermverm   2nd best
22:47   Jub3r7_   Joey just called me.
22:47   Jub3r7_   lol.
22:47   Vermverm   how's his rattata doing???
22:47   Jub3r7_   XD
22:47   Jub3r7_   He actually was trying to catch another rattata but failed.
22:48   Locke   Hey, I was reading this log you sent me, and I was confused about something
22:48   Locke   Who is "axem"
22:48   Locke   ?
22:48   Vermverm   idk bird likes to call you that
22:48   [Wry]   Hey guys
22:48   [Wry]   Was Mashi able to fix his problem?
22:49   Vermverm   mashi has lots of problems, which one?
22:49   Jub3r7_   OH
22:49   Jub3r7_   Wait
22:49   Jub3r7_   Aren't axem and Locke two different people?
22:49   Jub3r7_   Because I thought there was an account by the name of John Locke as well as Axem.
22:49   Vermverm   i think so, but i think he played some joke on bird and now bird thinks they're the same person
22:50   Jub3r7_   Also, I prefer Jub over jubert.
22:51   Vermverm   ok
22:51      *** Locke quit (Q:- http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
22:51      *** Locke joined #twg
22:52   Locke   My internet disconnected
22:52   Locke   01:47   Vermverm   how's his rattata doing??? 01:47   Jub3r7_   XD 01:47   Jub3r7_   He actually was trying to catch another rattata but failed. 01:48   Locke   Hey, I was reading this log you sent me, and I was confused about something 01:48   Locke   Who is "axem" 01:48   Locke   ?
22:52   Locke   Last thing I got.
22:52   Jub3r7_   Vermverm>   idk bird likes to call you that
22:52   Jub3r7_      <[Wry]>   Hey guys
22:52   Jub3r7_      <[Wry]>   Was Mashi able to fix his problem?
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Vermverm>   mashi has lots of problems, which one?
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Jub3r7_>   OH
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Jub3r7_>   Wait
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Jub3r7_>   Aren't axem and Locke two different people?
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Jub3r7_>   Because I thought there was an account by the name of John Locke as well as Axem.
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Vermverm>   i think so, but i think he played some joke on bird and now bird thinks they're the same person
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Jub3r7_>   Also, I prefer Jub over jubert.
22:52   Jub3r7_      <Vermverm>   ok
22:52   Jub3r7_   And then I was reading the log.
22:53   Jub3r7_   |<--   Locke has left irc.drshnaps.com (Q:- http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
22:53   Jub3r7_      -->|   Locke (Mibbit@shacops-89348ACA.asm.bellsouth.net) has joined #twg
22:53   Vermverm   he forgot 22:48   Vermverm   idk bird likes to call you that
22:53   Jub3r7_      <Locke>   My internet disconnected
22:53   Vermverm   that was first
22:53   Locke   Thanks
22:53   Jub3r7_   No I didn't, that's there.
22:53   Jub3r7_   "Locke>   Last thing I got.
22:53   Jub3r7_      <Jub3r7_>   Vermverm> idk bird likes to call you that
22:53   Jub3r7_      <Jub3r7_>   <[Wry]> Hey guys
22:53   Jub3r7_   inflection??
22:53   Vermverm   what
22:54   Locke   Bird is so gullible, falling for my jokes
22:54   Locke   Don't tell him I said that
22:54   Jub3r7_   People like to say Inflection whenever something's inside a thing inside another thing inside another thing.
22:54   Jub3r7_   Like, that book with the king who married women then killed them the next day?
22:55   Jub3r7_   The women managed to survive by telling him a story every night and leaving a huge cliff hanger for the next day.
22:55   Jub3r7_   And this kept going on and on until the king realized that he actually fell in love.
22:55   Jub3r7_   And those stories were actually told to the reader;
22:55      *** Bird-Away quit (Q:- ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 8.0/20111104165243])
22:55   Jub3r7_   a fisherman found a genie and the fisherman was like "this is like the story of ____
22:56   Jub3r7_   and then he told the story to the genie. :III
22:56   Jub3r7_   A
22:56   Jub3r7_   And that story had a cliff hanger too.
22:56   Jub3r7_   INFLECTION.
22:56   Jub3r7_   Also, my chumHandle for pesterchum (the chat client from homestuck that has been made into a real thing by fans) is hystericalInflection.
22:56   Jub3r7_   Abbreviated, it's HI.
22:57   Jub3r7_   Okay, this is how I am when I'm tired.
22:57   Jub3r7_   Don't think this is normal, okay? XD
22:57   [Wry]   [01:48:59]   [Wry]   Was Mashi able to fix his problem?
22:57   [Wry]   [01:49:12]   Vermverm   mashi has lots of problems, which one?
22:57   Jub3r7_   I posted that already!!!!
22:57   [Wry]   I'm offended on his behalf
22:58   Jub3r7_   Oh
22:58   Vermverm   'twas a joke
22:58   Jub3r7_   We all have a lot of problems.
22:58   Jub3r7_   I am an egotistical depressed person.
22:58   [Wry]   So guys
22:58   [Wry]   Cave Story, great game or best game
22:58   Jub3r7_   I'm a hyperactive 15 year old that acts 12.
22:59   [Wry]   Everyone thinks I'm older than I really am
22:59   Locke   How old are you
22:59   Vermverm   i think he's 4
22:59   Vermverm   did i break the trend???
23:00      *** Jub3r7__ joined #twg
23:00   Jub3r7__   Also, my concentration level.
23:00   [Wry]   Locke, I'll never tell
23:00   Jub3r7__   It used to be not very great, but I could concentrate enough to read something.
23:00   [Wry]   But guess anyways
23:00   Locke   14
23:00   [Wry]   lolno
23:00   Jub3r7__   *like, hundreds of pages at a time.
23:00   Vermverm   17
23:01   Jub3r7__   But my concentration is getting slowly worse.
23:01   [Wry]   closer
23:01   Locke   18
23:01   [Wry]   Guys, when posting stuff for twg and it's a wall of text, bold the important points
23:01      *** Jub3r7_ quit (Ping timeout)
23:02      *** Jub3r7__ is now known as Jub3r7_
23:02   Jub3r7_   Er
23:02   [Wry]   Especially for logs
23:02   Locke   If it's a wall of text then it's all important.
23:02   Vermverm   http://www.ninsheetm.us/smf/index.php?action=profile;u=401
23:02   Jub3r7_   The problem is, I've gotten really off topic.
23:02   [Wry]   The super important parts
23:02   Vermverm   16
23:02   Jub3r7_   I'm distracted enough and then it's even worse at 2:02 in the morning.
23:02   Jub3r7_   So.
23:03   Vermverm   what prompted you to say that wry
23:03   Vermverm   nobody posted any new logs
23:03   Jub3r7_   If any of you used this log for evidence.
23:03   Jub3r7_   Make sure to bold the part about joey calling me.
23:03   Jub3r7_   Because that's extremely important.
23:03   Vermverm   It's vry important.
23:03   Locke   Joey who
23:03   Vermverm   joey's rattata joey
23:04      *** Jub3r7__ joined #twg
23:04   Vermverm   http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Joey
23:06      *** Jub3r7_ quit (Ping timeout)
23:06      *** Jub3r7__ is now known as Jub3r7_
23:06   Jub3r7_   My rattata is in the top percentage of rattata!
23:09   Vermverm   all the rattatas are in the top percentage of rattata
23:10   Vermverm   am i still here my internet is going all weird
23:11      *** Jub3r7__ joined #twg
23:11      *** Jub3r7_ quit (Ping timeout)
23:11      *** Jub3r7__ is now known as Jub3r7_
23:11   Jub3r7_   Ahhh, much better
23:11   Jub3r7_   Hey, verm, Locke
23:11   Jub3r7_   If you have anything to add about TWG, say it now.
23:11   Jub3r7_   Or question me about, or things I need to post.
23:11   Vermverm   I don't really have anything else to ask.
23:12   Jub3r7_   And yes you are still here.
23:12   Jub3r7_   Locke?
23:13   Locke   My internet disconnected am I back yet
23:13   Locke   ?
23:14   Locke   Everyone's got internet problems.
23:14   Vermverm   yes you're here locket
23:15      *** Jub3r7__ joined #twg
23:15   Jub3r7__   Locke>   My internet disconnected am I back yet
23:15   Jub3r7__      <Jub3r7_>   Yes.
23:15   Jub3r7__   That's last thing I saw, anything after that before I go to sleep?
23:15   Vermverm   no
23:15   Jub3r7__   Oh, okay.
23:15   Jub3r7__   Anyways,
23:15   Jub3r7__   Good night.

[vermilionvermin]

Updated vote count:

Jub3r7 - 2 Votes (Gz, Bird)
Dude - 2 Votes (blueflower999 , spit)
shadowkirby - 1 vote (vermilionvermin (safety))
gzgregory - 1 vote (Locke (faux))
vermilionvermin - 1 vote (SuperFireKirby)
Locke – 1 vote (Dude)

People who should vote:  Shadow, gz, davy

[davy]

locke

Given that everyone but Dude has posted since I claimed traitor, I think the benefit of doing so is near-gone.

I am not the traitor.  This was a ploy to see if any wolves would claim to me or if the real traitor would counterclaim me.  Neither happened, and the benefit of having my claim out there is gone.

Bird and Locke were there with me when I decided to claim.  They can back me up on this.  In fact, they were the ones who encouraged me to do so.

It seemed like Locke and Bird were aware of the fact that Vermillion wasn't the traitor, and just wanted to reveal the wolves to the topic. If so, I wonder why locke posted this:

I highly recommend against the wolves claiming to the traitor.

That is the last thing we need, the wolf alliance fully assembling. But since you've let the cat out of the bag, I guess the wolves will have caught on and will claim to the traitor anyway.

Knowing Vermin wasn't the traitor, ther is just no reason for telling the wolves not to connect vermin. He should only want the wolves to claim him.

I think he just did this to seem human, which is exactly the thing wolves would do.

[Greg]

Going to switch to Dude for now, because that log makes Jub seem human to me. Locke's posts could have been a reverse psychology ploy, although worth keeping an eye on.

As for Locke's accusation, shenanigans broke my internet yesterday, and then when it was fixed and I came on, nobody was there but Bird-Away (he might be able to back me up on this), so I left after several minutes.

[SuperFireKirby]

ALL PLAYERS HAVE CLAIMED. THERE HAS BEEN NO COUNTER-CLAIM FOR HUNTER.

therefore I shall trust that the hunter is legit.

[blueflower999]

Leaving for Columbus for 2 days. Bye!

If Dude is leaving for 2 days... It sounds even more suspicious to me.

[vermilionvermin]

I'm going to go with Locke because I believe that it is the most substantive vote out there.  Let's look at the cases made against all other players who are getting votes:

Dude:  Was inactive and started being active.  This sounds like a typical Dude performance from what I've seen in my skimming of past TWGs.

Jub:  Was inactive and now is active.  Given his internet troubles, I'm not surprised he was inactive.

Me:  Most who have talked to me can conclude that I'm likely a human, and when it's more likely than not that I was painted red or the brutal miller, I think I should get the benefit of the doubt.  Claiming traitor isn't something a wolf would do.  Calling out this lynch for being a bad one isn't something a wolf would do, especially when I'd be next on the chopping block.

Gz:  I think this is a vote for inactivity.  Meh.

Locke:  I'm pretty sure Bird was the one who came up with the idea to have me claim traitor in the first place.  Locke may have had the original idea to have the traitor claim, but, let's face it.  No traitor would have claimed had somebody actually claimed traitor first and had a legitimate chance of fooling the wolves into counterclaiming.  Locke then sabotages the plan by encouraging the wolves not to claim to me.  That decreases the likelihood that the traitor counterclaims and decreases the likelihood that the wolves claim to me.  Had the wolves claimed, we would have won already.

When given the choice to vote between inactivity and suspicious action, I think we should vote for suspicious action.  Jub, Dude, and Gzg haven't done anything suspicious.  Inactivity might be a good reason to lynch, but we saw that Jub's inactivity was largely healed, that Dude's inactivity was not having time to even go on the forum (and now that seems to be picking up), and Gz's picked up on his activity too.

I wouldn't be doing this if there were a better option.  But there is.

[vermilionvermin]

I can't believe I wrote "were" instead of "weren't".   

Anyways, I'll be in the chat for the next few minutes and would like to talk to someone!

[Bird]

Locke:  I'm pretty sure Bird was the one who came up with the idea to have me claim traitor in the first place.  Locke may have had the original idea to have the traitor claim, but, let's face it.  No traitor would have claimed had somebody actually claimed traitor first and had a legitimate chance of fooling the wolves into counterclaiming.  Locke then sabotages the plan by encouraging the wolves not to claim to me.  That decreases the likelihood that the traitor counterclaims and decreases the likelihood that the wolves claim to me.  Had the wolves claimed, we would have won already.

I think you're misreading Locke's actions a bit. I think by saying things like "The last thing we need is the wolves and traitor assembling," he was pretty much goading the wolves into claiming to you. I don't know why I can't think of a better analogy than this, but it's sort of like an electric-proof person who is about to be tortured saying "No, ANYTHING but the cattle-prod!" knowing full-well that the cattle-prod will be the thing that hurts him the least. The torturer (analogous to the wolves) will say to himself "oh, if that's what's most effective against him, I'll use that".

That said, I've been suspicious of Locke this whole game for other reasons, and don't really have a problem with him being lynched.

[Bird]

Locke since Jub3r7 is acting a lot more human lately.