TWG CXVII Host Spook-Ups

[BlackDragonSlayer]

Poll's up!

[TheZeldaPianist275]

What does the part about the red player mean? If the Strange Man (spooky) guesses you correctly, are you killed regardless of color, or only if you're a red wolf?

If the Strange Man hits his win condition with a successful guess, all players holding lanterns die, along with whichever regular wolves have not been killed. Depending on how things shake out in the game, it could be only one person (if only one lantern is left and the sole remaining normal wolf has it) or it could be as many as five (if all three lanterns are held by human players and both normal wolves are still alive).

Also, players will not be informed who passed them a lantern.

[davy]

I lied lol. Impulsively bringing back an NSM classic:



TWG CXVII: The Lantern Keeper Redux

Spoiler

On a dark and stormy October night, 10 friends found themselves in a small, lantern-lit village. The village was strangely dark; entering it seemed to drown out all the light from the moon, rendering it difficult to see anything clearly. The only things making anything visible at all? Three old, rusty lanterns hanging from poles lining the street.

Wolves
1. Master Wolf
2. Wolf
3. Wolf

Humans
4. Seer--can send in a PM every night to see the color of a person's role.
5. Human
6. Human
7. Human
8. Human
9. Human

??
10. The Strange Man
A man who DOES NOT WANT to be seen. Every night phase he will privately guess the identities of the lanterns holders, and upon correctly guessing their identities, the lanterns are lost to the night, and their holders are killed, along with any red player. He cannot be wolfed; if an attempt to do so is made, the public will not be informed.

Items
3 Lanterns of the Night: at the start of the game, 3 randomly chosen players will become Lantern Holders and receive a Lantern of the Night. Each night, the 3 lanterns holders will privately vote to seer one of the holders. That holder's color is then privately disclosed to the other two holders. A lantern may be passed to another player who does not hold a lantern once per NIGHT PHASE ONLY, and the lantern holders will always be made aware of any changes of possession of a lantern.

Misc.
-The Strange Man is not in the initial pool of possible lantern holders, but he can be passed a lantern thereafter.
-If someone is killed while in possession of a lantern, it will be publicly announced that a lantern has been put out, and the Strange Man will only have to guess the holders of the remaining lanterns. However, if all three lantern holders are killed before the Strange Man guesses their identities, the Strange Man will die as well.
-No cardflips, instas are on. Classic rules, natch.

Victory Conditions
Wolves win when their numbers are at parity with humans & The Strange Man combined.
Humans win when the wolves are dead.
The Strange Man wins upon successfully guessing the lantern holders, but the game does not necessarily have to end at that point. Either of the other two teams may win with the Strange Man.

[close]

I know you've kept it identical to the original, but I still think you should add a miller. Firstly it makes sure that a red seering is not perfectly accurate, seccondly it disincentivizes humans from just teaming up with the Strange Man and revealing all Lantern Keepers if the miller is guaranteed to die with a correct guess.

Also just to make sure: is the Strange Man actually seered purple?

[TheZeldaPianist275]

Specs and I were discussing this earlier today actually. I agree that as it stands, dominant strategy is claim lantern holder and then let the strange man decimate both teams, which is against the spirit of the game. However, I resist the idea of adding a miller because up to six (!) people dying off of the strange man's guess seems a bit of overkill. Here are a couple other workarounds I've thought of

When the Strange Man guesses correctly, either

a) lantern holders + master wolf die
b) just lantern holders die
c) Game ends instantly and only Strange Man wins

Thoughts on any of those options? This game was designed back in the era of TWG where balancing wasn't hugely important because people...didn't really play that hard. Right now I'm leaning toward b). And yes, the Strange Man is seered purple.

[davy]

Specs and I were discussing this earlier today actually. I agree that as it stands, dominant strategy is claim lantern holder and then let the strange man decimate both teams, which is against the spirit of the game. However, I resist the idea of adding a miller because up to six (!) people dying off of the strange man's guess seems a bit of overkill. Here are a couple other workarounds I've thought of

When the Strange Man guesses correctly, either

a) lantern holders + master wolf die
b) just lantern holders die
c) Game ends instantly and only Strange Man wins

Thoughts on any of those options? This game was designed back in the era of TWG where balancing wasn't hugely important because people...didn't really play that hard. Right now I'm leaning toward b). And yes, the Strange Man is seered purple.

Out of these three, I prefer lantern holders + master wolf dying. Just lantern holders dying makes the game to swingy if all players holding the lanterns happen to be humans. The game ending instantly on a random guess would be quite annoying.

My preference would be lantern holders + 1 random wolf + 1 random human (not seer to not make it too swingy).

Also potentially making the Master Wolf immune to this kill (even if he has a lantern) so it is not possible that this kill just gets rid of all three wolves.

And I'd still add a miller to mess with the seer's abilities.

[davy]

Made an edit to my game following BDS's suggestion:

If that player would be lynched or wolfed, they will survive for one phase at the end of which they will die. During that phase, this player cannot vote, seer, or send in a wolfing.

[TheZeldaPianist275]

spoiler tagged for the sake of the people who don't care about this

My fear with adding a Miller is that it's a human team nerf, and having 3 wolves in a 10-player game is already unusually high. For the same reason I think I'd rather avoid having the Strange Man kill lantern holders + random wolf + random human—it just takes too big a chunk out of the human team, in all likelihood. It's messier that way too. I think I'd rather just go lanterns holders + master wolf. Is there an obvious problem with that I'm not spotting?

If you think making one of the humans a miller and having an accurate Strange Man guess kill lantern holders+master wolf balances things out, I'll defer to your judgment on those pieces. I'm good w that.

[close]

[davy]

spoiler tagged for the sake of the people who don't care about this

My fear with adding a Miller is that it's a human team nerf, and having 3 wolves in a 10-player game is already unusually high. For the same reason I think I'd rather avoid having the Strange Man kill lantern holders + random wolf + random human—it just takes too big a chunk out of the human team, in all likelihood. It's messier that way too. I think I'd rather just go lanterns holders + master wolf. Is there an obvious problem with that I'm not spotting?

If you think making one of the humans a miller and having an accurate Strange Man guess kill lantern holders+master wolf balances things out, I'll defer to your judgment on those pieces. I'm good w that.

[close]

Ok, ran some number and I conclude that with this number of wolves and humans, a miller is not necessairy. I would say that Strange Man kills one of the red wolves (determined before the game starts) then rather than the master wolf, so that when the Strange Man guesses correctly, the game doesn't just end when the Seer finds both reds.

[TheZeldaPianist275]

I think that solves it. Thanks Davy.

[SpecsFlyer17]

Would the red wolf that is tied to the Strange Man's win condition know it ahead of time? Basically would it be a separate role?

[TheZeldaPianist275]

I'm thinking probably not. Would probably just say that one of the normal wolves has a special mark on him that cause him to die when the Strange Man puts out the lanterns, but the wolf doesn't know it.

[davy]

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