[GCN] Wario World - "Greenhorn Forest" by Nine Lives

[Zeta]

Submission Information:
Series: Super Mario
Game: Wario World
Console: Nintendo GameCube
Title: Greenhorn Forest
Instrumentation Solo Piano
Arranger: Nine Lives

[attachment deleted by admin]

[NineLives]

Source:

I'll admit that the intro's bassline is a bit iffy. I have trouble hearing that part, particularly due to how strong the melody is.

[XiaoMigros]

General:

• The key of this track is C minor

RH:

• m9-12: The piano plays some chords here, maybe you could include those in another RH layer?
• m13-16: I hear octaves throughout for this part
• m16: The last note here sounds like it's in the chords layer rather than the melody layer
• m23: I hear an implied Eb at beat 4.75, you might want to add that in
• m27: I don't think the last note in this measure ties into the next one

LH:

• For m1 and similar I hear F# instead of F
• m2, 4 & 6: Beat 2 onwards is shifted by a 16th.
• m2: The last Ab sounds like a Bb
• m4 & 6: The last 4 notes are (in ascending order) Bb-D-F-Bb
• I hear this for m8:

  You cannot view this attachment.

  [close]
• m9: from beat 3.25-4 I hear C-staccato Eb-F-C
• m10: I hear an added Ab at beat 4
• m12: I hear Eb-C-Eb(eighth) for beat 4
• m13: I think the note at beat 4.25 starts on beat 4
• m14: Not sure what's going on for beat 4 but I think the Ab should be a 16th
• m16: The first 3 notes are Ab-C-Eb, and there's an F at beat 4.5
• The bassline in m17-24 is the same as in m5-12, so any parts you incorporate from there should be updated when needed
• m24: I hear an Eb at beat 4.5
• m27 beat 4 there's an F#
• m28 I hear G-C for the first 2 notes, beat 3.75 sounds tied into beat 4

Take the bass corrections with a grain of salt, I also don't find it the easiest to make out in certain places. If you disagree with me in some places that's cool

Once these points are addressed we can move on to the more interesting aspects of the sheet..

[NineLives]

Everything unlisted should be accounted for, excluding the bassline thing from measure 21 and onward. I kinda wanted to differentiate the section with some of its other instrumentation. The saxophone and bassoon(?) seemed like more prominent and important phrases in the piece to me to earn a spotlight

RH:

• m9-12: The piano plays some chords here, maybe you could include those in another RH layer?
• m13-16: I hear octaves throughout for this part
• m16: The last note here sounds like it's in the chords layer rather than the melody layer
• m23: I hear an implied Eb at beat 4.75, you might want to add that in

• I intended to keep the song more simple in the RH, given all the octaves you'd have to play through. Plus, I feel having the melody to itself works best in this particular arrangement.
• I believe, upon further listening, that the entire piano section is made up of octaves, so I added them from 9 to 16.
• I think the last note in measure 16 sort of works as both in the original. That's how it sounds to me anyways.
• I'm not sure what you mean by the Eb in measure 23 being implied. Just sounds like there's meant to be a rest there to me, so I shortened the previous note.

LH:

• I hear this for m8:

  You cannot view this attachment.

  [close]
• m9: from beat 3.25-4 I hear C-staccato Eb-F-C
• m10: I hear an added Ab at beat 4
• m14: Not sure what's going on for beat 4 but I think the Ab should be a 16th
• m24: I hear an Eb at beat 4.5
• m28 I hear G-C for the first 2 notes, beat 3.75 sounds tied into beat 4

• I hear some of what you heard in measure 8, but I also picked up on some notes that were different.
• I heard the first 3 notes you suggested for measure 9, but I do believe there's a rest on count 4. Also, I think of all the notes, the Eb has a staccato, but I think it flows better without it on the sheet.
• I can't say I hear the Ab in measure 10.
• In measure 14, I heard an Eb eighth on beat 4.5, so I added that in after the sixteenth.
• Measure 24, I hear the Eb, but that's moreso the bass than the saxophone part I switched to for the section, which is held over it.
• Measure 28, I don't hear the note in count 3.75 sounding tied. It seems like there's a rest right after to me.

[XiaoMigros]

Everything unlisted should be accounted for, excluding the bassline thing from measure 21 and onward. I kinda wanted to differentiate the section with some of its other instrumentation. The saxophone and bassoon(?) seemed like more prominent and important phrases in the piece to me to earn a spotlight

I agree! Sorry I wasn't clear enough, I only thought it was worth changing those places in that section where you included the bass.

[m9-12] - I intended to keep the song more simple in the RH, given all the octaves you'd have to play through. Plus, I feel having the melody to itself works best in this particular arrangement.
- I believe, upon further listening, that the entire piano section is made up of octaves, so I added them from 9 to 16.

I hear the octaves as well My suggestion with including the chords was meant as an alternative to writing octaves constantly, to give a little variation. Up to you though, could go either way

I think the last note in measure 16 sort of works as both in the original. That's how it sounds to me anyways.

To me it sounds like it belongs to the background, especially since I can't hear it be struck as prominently as other notes in the melody. Even compared to other accompaniment parts it's relatively faint.

I'm not sure what you mean by the Eb in measure 23 being implied. Just sounds like there's meant to be a rest there to me, so I shortened the previous note.

I think the instrument here hints at an Eb on beat 4.75 but doesn't produce a clear sound with it, similar to beat 2.75 of m13. To me, adding it in makes sense, especially for the continuity of this phrase, but if you would rather leave it out that's perfectly fine

- I heard the first 3 notes you suggested for measure 9, but I do believe there's a rest on count 4. Also, I think of all the notes, the Eb has a staccato, but I think it flows better without it on the sheet.
- I can't say I hear the Ab in measure 10.

Sorry if I wasn't clear enough, but yes the staccato is on the Eb (omitting it is fine though).
I wonder what's up with these notes on beat 4 then, because I can hear them quite well (compared to other parts of the bass that I'm less sure on). Maybe the bass drum is obscuring them?

Measure 24, I hear the Eb, but that's moreso the bass than the saxophone part I switched to for the section, which is held over it.

Have you considered including it regardless? It sounds quite prominent, but leaving it out is okay with me as well

Measure 28, I don't hear the note in count 3.75 sounding tied. It seems like there's a rest right after to me.

Not sure what to say here aside from I don't hear the rest at all

In general, I think most of what I hear should be correct, but it's probably best to wait for a second opinion on it.

• To avoid instances like L.H. m22, it's acceptable to write the F# as Gb in a lot of places in this sheet. You can change them for every occurence where the F#/Gb leads to/from F natural, provided that F# isn't still effective (not present in measure or cancelled)
• Are you happy with the playability of m33 at the moment? I hear something along the lines of the image below, but obviously it's not realistic to include all of this:
  Spoiler

  You cannot view this attachment.

  [close]

[NineLives]

I hear the octaves as well My suggestion with including the chords was meant as an alternative to writing octaves constantly, to give a little variation. Up to you though, could go either way
To me it sounds like it belongs to the background, especially since I can't hear it be struck as prominently as other notes in the melody. Even compared to other accompaniment parts it's relatively faint.

I'd rather leave the chords out and focus on the melody. That said, in measure 16, I do believe that last note is part of the melody. Hearing the chords in that measure, they sound more like Eb chords rather than F chords. That octave also sounds like it strikes louder than the chords too.

I think the instrument here hints at an Eb on beat 4.75 but doesn't produce a clear sound with it, similar to beat 2.75 of m13. To me, adding it in makes sense, especially for the continuity of this phrase, but if you would rather leave it out that's perfectly fine

I hear beat 2.75 in measure 13 though. I don't just hear it as implied, I actually hear that note for certain.
I definitely don't hear the note in measure 23. I get it may or may not be implied, but I'd rather leave it out, 'cause I'm not so sure how we can establish that.

I wonder what's up with these notes on beat 4 then, because I can hear them quite well (compared to other parts of the bass that I'm less sure on). Maybe the bass drum is obscuring them?

I kinda hear them now. Maybe the percussion does get in the way. I'm iffy on measure 10, but measure 9 sounds right, but it's weird, because I think that note extends to the end of the measure, so it sounds odd in the original. I've added both in.

Have you considered including it regardless? It sounds quite prominent, but leaving it out is okay with me as well

I tried it. I personally would rather leave it out though. It sounds a bit strange to me.

Not sure what to say here aside from I don't hear the rest at all

I either hear the note as staccato'd or maybe even portato'd(I think that's the right word; I meant the tenuto over the staccato). I just know I don't hear the two notes connecting in a way that makes the first one sound fully tied.

• Are you happy with the playability of m33 at the moment? I hear something along the lines of the image below, but obviously it's not realistic to include all of this:
  Spoiler

  You cannot view this attachment.

  [close]

I'd rather stick to only the last measure having the little flute phrase. Also, I listened to it a bit on a really slow speed, and I do believe the first three notes in your phrase through the last measure is right, but the others sound like the way I had before. I did change sharps to flats though.

[XiaoMigros]

I'd rather leave the chords out and focus on the melody. That said, in measure 16, I do believe that last note is part of the melody. Hearing the chords in that measure, they sound more like Eb chords rather than F chords. That octave also sounds like it strikes louder than the chords too.

Leaving out the chords is a valid option, and since that's what you prefer it's fine with me too. As for m16, you're welcome to leave it in for now as well, but I think getting a second opinion from another updater would be good.

I hear beat 2.75 in measure 13 though. I don't just hear it as implied, I actually hear that note for certain.
I definitely don't hear the note in measure 23. I get it may or may not be implied, but I'd rather leave it out, 'cause I'm not so sure how we can establish that.

To me both m13 and m23 sound equally existent/implied, but maybe that isn't the case. I don't have anything to add here, so leaving this as is works too

I either hear the note as staccato'd or maybe even portato'd(I think that's the right word; I meant the tenuto over the staccato). I just know I don't hear the two notes connecting in a way that makes the first one sound fully tied.

I think I see where you're coming from now. Maybe a regular tenuto on the 16th is a fair compromise? That way we get the extra duration/weightedness without the implied continuity of adding a tied note.

I'd rather stick to only the last measure having the little flute phrase. Also, I listened to it a bit on a really slow speed, and I do believe the first three notes in your phrase through the last measure is right, but the others sound like the way I had before. I did change sharps to flats though.

Not having the flute play in the previous measure is a sensible option, but my main concern with this section is how playable it is. I think 8 consecutive 32nds at this tempo might be a little too much, but what do you think?
To make it a little easier, you could e.g. leave out some more notes, or have the LH play some of the last few.

• Looking at the musx I still see a couple of places where I think flats would be better than sharps: m4, m8, m12, m14, m20, m26 RH
  Let me know if you disagree with any of those!

[NineLives]

I think I see where you're coming from now. Maybe a regular tenuto on the 16th is a fair compromise? That way we get the extra duration/weightedness without the implied continuity of adding a tied note.

I can get behind that suggestion. That could work.

Not having the flute play in the previous measure is a sensible option, but my main concern with this section is how playable it is. I think 8 consecutive 32nds at this tempo might be a little too much, but what do you think?
To make it a little easier, you could e.g. leave out some more notes, or have the LH play some of the last few.

I had the last two notes of the phrase cross staff to the left hand. I feel like that'd be okay, but if you think it should take the C's too, just to be safe, I wouldn't mind doing that as well.

[XiaoMigros]

I had the last two notes of the phrase cross staff to the left hand. I feel like that'd be okay, but if you think it should take the C's too, just to be safe, I wouldn't mind doing that as well.

Since the C is already covered by the RH at the start of the phrase, so I think it's fine as is (and allowing the RH to rest in this position makes it easier to play).

• I've found some more F#s that are better off as Gbs: LH m12, LH m14, LH m24
• Some of the measures on the last page are a bit cramped, I think 3 per system might be too much in some places.
  I did some messing with it and removing the margins between systems and rearranging the measure distribution gave me this result:
  
  Spoiler

  You cannot view this attachment.

  [close]
  Feel free to come up with something else, this was partly just me having fun lol

[NineLives]

Okie doke. Should have everything above in now.

[XiaoMigros]

Looks good! If you could click in the the second-to-last measure with the note entry tool that would be great, so that Finale accomodates for the clef better.
Aside from that I don't have anything to add, so I'll approve~

[Zeila]

Trying to figure out the bass EP part was hard ;~; but raising it by two whole octaves really helped me a lot. Still take it with a grain of salt though

• m. 4 LH - beat 3.75 I think the Bb here is an octave higher. It also sounds like the last eighth note sounds different compared to the other staccato ones, but it doesn't sound fully held either, so maybe a tenuto staccato could suffice if the distinction is even worth pointing out in the first place. You don't have to change the articulation though because I'm not even entirely sure about that
• m. 5/7/17/19/31 LH - you missed changing the F's to F#'s here as well, just like measures 1/3
• m. 8/20 LH - I'm hearing this instead. I think the part you have written now is part of a different voicing, although it is more prominent sounding so you could write it like that instead. If you're going to leave it as is, then I think the 3rd Bb on beat 4.25 is incorrect and should be a staccato eighth note Fn on beat 4
  You cannot view this attachment.
• m. 9 LH - beat 3.5 sounds like a sixteenth note rest inetsad of an Eb; beat 3.75 Fn sounds like F# still
• m. 10 LH - you should switch the accidental to the first F
• m. 12/14 - you should include courtesy accidentals on the Fn's here too if you wrote them in elsewhere
• m. 14 RH - beat 2 I think the staccato on the F's should be a tenuto instead
• m. 14 LH - I think the last A is a staccato eighth note on beat 4 rather than a sixteenth rest + sixteenth note A
• m. 16 LH - I think the last two eighth notes sound like another tenuto -> staccato combo just like beat 1 instead of staccato -> nothing
• m. 21 LH - I'm hearing something like this?? really unsure though
  You cannot view this attachment.
• m. 23/31 - courtesy accidentals here are unnecessary given the new system with the key signature reminder, but it's fine if you want to keep them
• m. 23-24 LH - I'm hearing something else starting beat 4.5 of m. 23, but I'm also very unsure about it
  You cannot view this attachment.
• m. 27 LH - beat 4 I think this eighth note should have a staccato
• m. 32 LH - this is the exact same as measure 2 with the shifted rhythms and the Bb instead of the last Ab

[NineLives]

I've updated the sheet with almost all the changes mentioned above, but I have a few opposing thoughts on some of them and rewrote portions based on those as well.

• m. 8/20 LH - I'm hearing this instead. I think the part you have written now is part of a different voicing, although it is more prominent sounding so you could write it like that instead. If you're going to leave it as is, then I think the 3rd Bb on beat 4.25 is incorrect and should be a staccato eighth note Fn on beat 4
  You cannot view this attachment.
• m. 9 LH - beat 3.5 sounds like a sixteenth note rest inetsad of an Eb; beat 3.75 Fn sounds like F# still
• m. 14 RH - beat 2 I think the staccato on the F's should be a tenuto instead
• m. 14 LH - I think the last A is a staccato eighth note on beat 4 rather than a sixteenth rest + sixteenth note A
• m. 16 LH - I think the last two eighth notes sound like another tenuto -> staccato combo just like beat 1 instead of staccato -> nothing
• m. 21 LH - I'm hearing something like this?? really unsure though
  You cannot view this attachment.
• m. 23-24 LH - I'm hearing something else starting beat 4.5 of m. 23, but I'm also very unsure about it
  You cannot view this attachment.

• m. 8/20 LH - While I don't hear the bass you have written down, I do hear the secondary option and have adjusted it accordingly, since, as you said, it was more prominent.
• m. 9 LH - I agree with the F#, but I don't believe the next note is a rest. I hear it play there, but it drones on longer than it does how we've written it here, similar to the Ab on beat 4 of the next measure, which may verify the similar-sounding secondary voice you mentioned for measures 8 and 20.
• m. 14 RH - To me, beat 2 sounds as long as the notes surrounding it in the source, so I'll keep it the same.
• m. 14 LH - I hear this the way I have it written too. I don't hear it hit on beat 4 compared to the 16th after it.
• m. 16 LH - Listening again, I hear it similarly to how the last two eighth notes of the previous measure are played, so I decided to have no articulations for those as well.
• m. 21 LH - The first half of the measure sounded correct, but the second sounded like I had it. There is a regular bass note that hits on 4.25, but the focus here is the baritone/bass sax part, so I'll leave it out.
• m. 23-24 LH - Beat 4.5 sounds like how I had it with the sixteenths, but I will admit that the first note itself plays again rather than another C on beat one. I don't hear those notes as F naturals though. F# sounds correct, but people can weigh in on that.

Hopefully, I haven't forgotten or left out anything, but if I did, let me know!

[Kricketune54]

Checked the LH, I agree with the notes that are currently present. Thank you Zeila for helping sort that out.

Just a couple additional thoughts

• m27 maybe you could add a sfz or a mp/p dynamic above the RH and have a cresc. up to m29?
• m28 the parentheses doesn't make sense in the RH as the LH  beat 4.25 note is an Fn not F#? Perhaps add an accidental to the LH note.

[NineLives]

Everything's up to date!